Work Visa (w business)

Can I get a work Visa in China if I use money and get a WFOE?

Can a spouse get a work visa (even if she only has college education) through association with me, if I get a work visa from my employer?

I do not see the formation of a WFOE as a realistic option for getting a work visa.

Forming a WFOE takes a hell of a lot of time and a hell of a lot of money. I think that if someone needs to work for an income then it is unlikely they are going to be in a position to form a WFOE.

China Law Blog gives some idea of some of the requirements for forming a WFOE:
http://www.chinalawblog.com/2010/08/how_to_form_a_china_wfoewofe_why_we_are_slow_but_always_succeed.html

There really is no back-door way of getting a visa to stay in China. Unless you have a viable business proposition you can forget about forming a WFOE.

Should you get to form a WFOE there is no guarantee that your girlfriend would get a visa.
 

http://www.mychinavisa.com/faq.php#14

This website says wives can get work visas to.

I was talking about if I got a work visa because I have a good job in China, can my wife get a work visa to? (if she is just college educated) That is the question that is bugging me.

I think WFOE only cost 15,000 American dollars if its in the service industry though.

Family Members

Accompanying spouse and children are given the same type of visa and residence permit as the one who will be employed or studying in China, though each family member will have to fill out an individual application and pay the application fees. If the stork should find you in China, you’ll need to bring your new baby’s birth certificate to the local PSB for registration.

China does not recognize gay or lesbian unions, nor do they extend any familial benefits to unmarried heterosexual couples. Significant others will have to apply for their own visa and residency with their own sponsorship.

If you have an employment visa and residency based on a family member’s employment, you may find your own employment while in China. However, your new employer will then have to register your employment and file the necessary paperwork to make it legal.

http://www.transitionsabroad.com/listings/living/livingabroadin/living_abroad_visas_and_residence_in_china.shtml

"ONLY" $15,000 US?
Anyway, this is putting it only in terms of money. It doesn't include the large amount of time and effort that's also involved.
I'm xwith xwarrior here...a WFOE doesn't seem to be a very reasonable or reliable way to get a Residence Permit.

Spouses and children can get a Residence Permit under your aegis if you have an RP yourself. However, that doesn't extend to Work Permits...your wife can reside with you, but she can't necessarily work. She would have to get her own WP before she can legally work.

You keep saying that your wife "only has a college education."
What does that mean, exactly? Does it mean she has college hours but no degree? If so, she can't get a WP, since that requires a degree. If she DOES have a degree, then she should have no problems getting a WP if she can find an employer who will issue her the documents needed, such as an invitation letter.

Remember...the documents you ultimately really need are a Work Permit and Residence Permit, NOT a "work visa". Again, she can get the right to enter China and live there with you...but gaining the right to work is an entirely different matter.
That "mychinavisa.com" site IMHO doesn't seem to be very reliable or authoritative.

I know it is difficult, but shouldn't getting a WOFE or JV mean you can get a work permit without any degree? Since you now own a business in China and you need the proper permit to actually work. Since you are almost like a CEO now: doesn't that make you eligable for a work permit?

I'm not just coming to China to start a WOFE, there is more thought into that. I just can't get the right information from online sources so far. I want to know if its legally and socially possible. I know its hard, but we wouldn't be dependent on the income brought in by that company.

Yes, you should be able to get the right to work for your own enterprise...eventually.
But it won't cover you for working somewhere else, and won't necessarily help your wife out at all...

Yes, you should be able to get the right to work for your own enterprise...eventually.
But it won't cover you for working somewhere else, and won't necessarily help your wife out at all...

What do you mean it won't cover me for working somewhere else? I don't understand.

Thank you for helping me Raoul.  

This is a way for her to do something productive and make a little money. The investment that you put into a company is still your money and if the company doesn't work I am sure you can liquidate it and gets some of your money back.

I am more looking for a way for her to make a little bit of money that she can contribute and have something to do. If this also gets her a work permit she can potentially work for an employer there.

Ain't no thang, muh man.
Work Permits are specific to a given employer. So your WP might give you the right to work for your own enterprise...but won't cover you if you also want to teach full-time for someone else.

Ain't no thang, muh man.
Work Permits are specific to a given employer. So your WP might give you the right to work for your own enterprise...but won't cover you if you also want to teach full-time for someone else.

Actually that is what I wanted to know. So if we set up our own business we can get work permits that let us work for our own business?

 

That seems to indicate setting up companies in China is a good way to be employed in China. Just that getting a business to work - anywhere - is very difficult. Does this include Joint Ventures as well?

Me and my wife have a company in Hong Kong and one in the mainland, the one in Hong Kong cannot provide a working visa for the mainland but is greatly suited towards the export business we have so it's great. As for the mainland company it isn't large enough to support a working visa currently so I still need a gig with a residency permit. For me it's ok because my wife runs most of the business and I help out with things when needed.
Foreign owned companies need to be certain sizes before they can employ foreign employees. Unfortunantly depending on which province you are looking at there are a number of roadblocks that will be thrown up in your path as in all honestly China doesn't honestly want a number of foreign companies to be competitive with the locals.
Although there are different levels of acquirement for different businesses, if I wanted to get a working Visa out of my company I would need to hire 6 more Chinese staff and expand our office holdings and revenue significantly.
If you are looking seriously to do this then you need to contact a reputable Chinese lawyer in the province/city that you intend to set up the business and discuss details are requirements. It won't be free but information you find online is consistently unreliable and in my opinion not to be trusted as a go ahead.
Location is important as the eastern provinces are much better suited for setting up companies than the western ones as it depends on the local regulations as to how difficult it is to set up a company, and how many barriers will be thrown up in your way.
A friend of mine just got his approval to set up a wholly owned foreign enterprise, he set up a resteraunt and it took him about 6 months to get it sorted out and he needed to have 8 Chinese employees on the go to have it set up. Things are looking up for him, but it was a battle as the local regulators were very resistant to it being wholly foreign owned and wanted him to have a Chinese partner.
In the end he was persistent and kept slugging away at it but it was probably guanxi that got him there in the end. This is out in the western provinces though and it is usually a little easier in the east.
Another friend of mine set up a couple of bars and had to have a Chinese business partner on paper (his wife) before they would give him the go ahead.
Again, look up a reputable Chinese lawyer in the area that you want to set it up in and pay for professional advice before giving it serious thought. 

That seems to indicate setting up companies in China is a good way to be employed in China. Just that getting a business to work - anywhere - is very difficult. Does this include Joint Ventures as well?

1. Setting up a company in China is not a good way to get a visa - it is a good way to kiss your ass goodbye unless you are totally familiar with Chinese business practices

2. If you are totally familiar with Chinese business practices it is unlikely that you would want to form a company in China

3. US15,000 is the tip of a very large iceberg. For example:
"The real question is what the Chinese authorities will consider as adequate capitalization for the specific project. Of course, that answer varies by type of business and location. For example, it is very expensive to operate a business in Shanghai. On the other hand, it can be very inexpensive to operate the same business in a rural area of China. It is expensive to operate a capital intensive business like manufacturing, but relatively inexpensive to operate a knowledge based consulting business.

The Chinese regulators usually consider all of these issues. To complicate matters, each local regulator has its own basic standards on what constitutes adequate capital for certain types of business activities. These numbers are not published, but when asked they will almost always be provided. They can only be determined through direct contact with the regulator and only after providing a clear explanation of the project. The local regulator virtually never considers the statutory minimum in making a determination regarding adequacy of capital. Rather, the local regulator will determine what it believes is an adequate amount of capital based on all the circumstances. Once the investor has a clear idea of the outlines of a project, it is usually a good idea to engage an attorney to contact the local regulator to see what their response will be to the proposed amount of investment. This initial screening can save a lot of time if the investor's idea of the proper amount of capitalization is dramatically different from that of the local regulator.

In determining what constitutes adequate capital, one needs to consider the peculiar situation in China that building rents are virtually always paid in advance, that payment for products for sale are virtually always paid in advance, and that a reasonable advance reserve for salaries is also required. Thus, the initial start up costs are much higher than in a location like the United States, where credit and time payments are more common. In addition, the foreign investor needs to take into account the risk aversion of the Chinese regulator. The Chinese regulator will not approve a project that looks risky or under-funded. The regulator has no incentive to do this, especially for a 100% foreign owned entity."


3, Start reading through China Law Blog ( http://www.chinalawblog.com/), as recommended, for background on company law in China (WFOE, JVO, etc)

4. A lot of spouses do unpaid voluntary work - it does not bring in money but they find it is a rewarding use of their time

Why do you want to start a business in China? There's lots of potentially good reasons. Well, one good reason; low labour and material costs. You just haven't said much about what your business will be.

However, you give the impression that you just want to come and live in China, so hey, why not start some kind of business. This would be a bad idea, (the strength of that understatement may well have caused further seismic activity on the eastern seaboard),  but there's lots of western businesses thriving in China. I'd imagine that most of them export specialist products to foreign markets.

I don't know that you could hire foreign staff very easily, so any foreigners that you want to have working for the company may have to be owners.

What concerns me is that you may not have a valid skill or area of knowledge. For instance, if you said, I've worked i x field for 20 years and I've designed and trademarked a new product that nobody else has, that would be good. If on the other hand you're saying, well I've studied a bit of business, so I think I'll start a business and export something, but I don't know what yet - that would be bad.

Most cities will have Business forums where foreigners can get together with locals and network. It would be my guess though that the skills needed to run businesses in the west may be quite different from those needed in China.

However, if you have a solid business idea, where you'll quickly generate high profits because of keeping costs low, than why not?

Does that mean that the owners can get a work permit, regardless of the size of the company?

So the situation is that I am looking to find work in China under accountancy. I'm trying to see if my girlfriend (who will have a Z Visa like me) would be able to set up a CJV with some family member in Mainland China (GF is Canadian national, but she is Chinese), the CJV would be a company but in reality its just going to be a little shop where she can bake/cook things and sell them. She doesn't have a university degree, only college diplomas. Would being "Partner" of this company allow her to register for a work permit as the company, to work in that same shop?

Is this crazy? Or legally legal?

I'm really bummed out. I can't find these answers on the internet.

I appreciate your guys answers. I am learning a lot of new things.

Is this crazy? Or legally legal?

I'm really bummed out. I can't find these answers on the internet.

I appreciate your guys answers. I am learning a lot of new things.

  Seriously, you need to find a good Chinese lawyer in the city where you want to set this up and ask for professional advice regarding your questions. You are NOT going to find such specific info on forums or by conducting google searches. If your wife has family in the place where you want to settle then ask them for the name and contact info of a good Chinese lawyer to engage with.
As for a general answer (based on personal experience and info I have from friends, which is NOT reliable) being an owner of a compnay, especially from your description of not wanting or being able to plunge a serious amount of cash into the business does not entitle you to a work permit and residency permit. China will give you these things but generally only after sinking SERIOUS money into a venture.

Also you are asking for a general rule about how things are done, which just plainly doesn't exist in China. Rules and laws (if they are even enforced) change from province to province and city to city.