Is your country civilised??

Yes, as should the "distance between people and their poop" chestnut.

France and Belgium do not have sit down toilets at rest stops and other places. Many times here I have felt deja vu from toilettes in europe. YET most people, especially their citizens, would unequivacally state that these countries are civilized.

However the whole don't crap in your food, don't eat poop  (and that is on a t-shirt available commercially in chinese through barfblog.com) public health thing I think is a much better judge of civilization. Institues of higher education and tolerance are also signs of civility.

Words come and go and many are just that with politics and economics. Many times social justice is relegated to only certain classes of citizens, but a structured system of public health for everyone, that is civilization.
 

Do you consider China to be civilized?
(either according to the questions offered or your own criteria)

Do you consider China to be civilized?

From what I can tell, it's maybe getting there, but is still a "Work In Progress".

The kindness of the people makes it incredibly civilised.

The trashing of the country (all forms of pollution) makes it uncivilised. 

I was in Singapore for the last few days.
Pretty much mostly Chinese - 75% I think is the stat.
There is no gum-chewing.
People obey right of way in traffic.
People walk across the street against the signals, but not impeding others' progress.

It seems quite civilized as far as organization.

But, I've never had so many people (all Chinese) cut in front of me and demand service before me. After getting quite frustrated and asking around, I was told that the Chinese in Singapore consider themselves superior to westerners (perhaps partly because I  was not well dressed or well groomed) and superior to Chinese from Malaysia for example. They don't have to wait for others - they can go first even if you got their first.

To me, this level of arrogance makes anyone well-groomed, well-paid, well-educated jerk quite uncivilized. In the west, I was never treated this way by adults, only snubbed by punks, gang-bangers and other adolescent types of "something to prove" people. This surprised me, but felt a bit familiar as I had experienced it a bit in Beijing.

I actually considered moving to S'pore for awhile until I experienced what the people that live there are like.

Hola!

I am an American. Pretty much a typical American, except that I am a bit more worldly than many of my "countrymen", since I have lived in China for over 7 years and have met people from all over the World. I think the United States are in the death throes now, with the nation falling apart like the USSR in about 50 years time. My views are mine and do not necessarily reflect the views of anyone else.

1. The military-industrial complex plays no role in the government of your country.

The military-industrial complex was coined by President Dwight Eisenhower in his televised farewell address to the nation in January of 1961. He warned against such a thing, but like all aulturistic things mentioned by wise leaders, it has been pretty much ignored. Today the United States is spending BILLIONS of dollars involved in military operations in Iraq and the Middle East, which has resulted in the deaths of 4,100 service people, most of whom were younger than 30 years of age. The military industiral complex is making millions if not billions in weapons, in the meantime murdering innocent civilians.

2. Religion plays a very small role in society in your country; neither forbidden nor compulsory.

People say that America is soooo religious, and it is in certain parts of the nation. I believe in God, I believe in Jesus Christ, however I do not believe in religion because it is man made, and no religion has come close to the realization of what God is. Many religions are very destructive and devisive. Then there are the people on the other side of the spectrum, the atheists and the secular humanists who believe themselves to be god, and since they are god, can do whatever they want, which is chaos and anarchy. Homosexuality has been presented by them as an alternate lifestyle. Abortion, which is the murder of babies for lucre is an abomination. America is being led by a President who is a murderer, a fraud, a thief and a coward.

3. Scientists, teachers, nurses and artists are all valued more than sports people and celebrities in your country.

Have you seen the salaries that pro athletes make?


4. Speech is free and the media varied with many different owners in your country.

The United States, even today has one of the freest protections of speech and assembly, however this scares the hell out of the current powers that be. This "terrorism hysteria" of the past 8 years has people trading some freedom for security which never works. This is what Nazi Germany did. Benjermin Franklin once said that people who surrender freedom for security deserves neither. I am in full agreement.

The media in the United States are over 90% owned by pro-Israeli Jewish interests which has slowly but very successfully have stuffed all kinds of absurdities down the throats of the public. (gay marriage being an example.) The media is the one that is in the cheering section of this bloodbath in Iraq. What is good about the internet is that people now have a choice in media, and be able to cut through a lot of the lies and misinformation out there.

5. There are few if any guns owned by people in your country.


The United States has probably the highest gun ownership anywhere in the World. Personally, I hate guns. Especially handguns. A handgun is designed to kill human beings. Now some fascist NRA knuckledragger will tell you that he shoots beer cans in the backyard with his, but that's not the primary purpose. However, if guns were made illegal, then only people who have no respect for the lawm will have the guns, and some of these people will prey on those who are law abiding citizens. The United States also has a lot of dangerous minorities, and if I am in the 'hood working in a shop, you damn betcha I will keep a 12 guage under the counter (stick up a Korean grocer in Watts and see!)

6. The environment of your country is cared for as the highest priority.

No one gives a damn about the environment. Do you want a job making shit, or do you want to go hungry hugging a tree? These are the two choices.

7. The government of your country does not execute its people.

In 38 states out of 50, there are death penalty stautes on the books. Of the 38, some states execute more than others, the first being Texas, then Florida, then Virginia. Personally, I have little problem with the death penalty. Some crimes are just too brutal. Ted Bundy murdered over 30 women, the last being a 12 year old schoolgirl that he kidnapped, raped, sodomized, murdered and threw away like a piece of trash. Do you think that MF'er deserves three hots and a cot paid for by my taxes?

However, the death penalty is not fair, not proportionate, with some people getting life, and some people getting death for similiar crimes. I would support putting all these low lifes in a supermaximum prison where they live in a cell alone with no human contact, no TV/radio/books/entertainments eating bread and water for the rest of their lives.

8. Women have full social and economic equality with men in your country.

I think now, and in the past 20 years or so that women have caught up with men in this regard. Problem with women is that many of them get married and have children, and then re enter the workforce at a later date because of this, which shows in studies as them making less money than men. With the economy the way it is, both sexes have to work, which makes things equalled out. I have had many women bosses in America.

9. Minorities, whether ethnic, linguistic, cultural or religious, are not persecuted in your country.

Depends on the minority discussed. More mistrust than anything else. The blacks have not improved themselves since the 1960s, quite the opposite. Their neighborhoods are poor and violent, drugs are readily available, their "leaders" have told them that they are somehow victims, many blacks regard success as being an Uncle Tom, and frankly, most whites want nothing to do with the majority of them.

Bill Cosby, an American black comedian, entertainer and eduactor has discussed at length about the problems in his community. He was born in a poor black neighborhood in Philidelphia who earned everything he got. Did his audience hear him? No, they ridiculed him and the media railed him down. Why tell the truth?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound_Cake_speech

10. Your country does not consider sexuality a criterion for human rights.

If you are talking about the gays, they have equal rights as anyone else. They can march down the street in their perverse parades naked, wearing leather and flip the bird at anyone who thinks they need psychological help.

11. Education of children is universal, free and secular in your country.

Education is not free, it is paid for either by tuition or through government taxation.

12. Other species of animals are respected, valued and protected by the people of your country.

I would say so. Killing a bald eagle is a federal offense. Recently, a pro-footballer named Michael Vick was sentenced to several years in prison for operating a dog fighting ring that actually hung non preforming dogs by the neck. Cock-fighting is illegal. I cannot juggle cats naked in the public square. Perhaps if chickens had the right to vote (either by voting with their funny three toed foot, or deficating on it) we might get better leaders.


13. Everyone secretly votes in your country and every vote is openly counted independent of government.

The local government oversees all elections. People with felony records usually cannot vote. Elections in the USA are usually fair, but not beyond occasional corruption. The most greivous theft of an election was in 2000 when George Bush stole the election with the help of his brother Jeb. At least in an honest election, America would of ended up with Gore the environmental twit instead of Bush the serial killer, but who knows. Clinton also bombed innocent people and Al didn't say anything.


14. Regulation protects people from giant corporations operating in your country.

Yes and no. Some of the problem stems from over regualtion, of government getting involved in free enterprise.

15. Your armies do not invade other countries and war isn't glorified in your country.

The United States unilaterally invaded Iraq in 2003, which has resulted in the deaths of over one million Iraqis, the financial rape of that nation and the deaths of over 4,100 fine men and women, most of whom joined the service in the first place because the cost of going to University was out their reach and their over taxed, over priced, over burderned parents.

16. Your country does not consider wealth a criterion for political success, or social worth.

The President of the United States is a multi-millionaire. V.P. Cheney is a multimillionaire. My state governor is a millionaire. My two U.S. Senators representing my state are millionaires. Obama is a millionaire. McCain is a millionaire. The Clintons are millionaires. I am not saying that being rich is bad, I like my state governor, he's a Democrat, a very smart man who went to Harvard who has done a lot of good things for the state. But it is difficult if not impossible for someone of normal means to get high political position without a lot of money and support from one of the two main corrupted political parties.


17. Art and heritage are valued in your country and literature, film and television increase in quality over time.

Entertainment has changed so much in the past 20 years due to first, cable television, VCR/DVD players, then the internet. Cable television has created small niches in the viewing public, withe everyone having a channel devoted to them. There is sooooo much available now, which is good and bad.


18. In your country natural disasters bring massive state support for the hurt, homeless and helpless.

In 2004, a major hurricane hit New Orleans Louisiana more or less destroying the place. The government was slow to respond because most of the military who would be there for cleanup was gone in the Middle East. Secondly, FEMA, the government department who was responsible for saving lives was ineffectual, mainly because it was given to a Bush crony who didn't know his ass from a hole in the ground.

New Orleans is also occupied by a majority poor black population, a population that the government doesn't give anything about, especially to the Republicans to whom the blacks did not vote for. Most of these poor people did not have cars, where they going to go?
Bush didn't care that these people drowned. Middle America doesn't care if they drowned, as long as they didn't move to their town.


19. The old, the sick and the disabled are cared for by your country, not profited from.

There is Social Security, a program that I personally abhor. What right does the government have to take part of my pay away from me "to hold" until I reach a certain age? Then give me a number like a criminal? What if I die before I am 65, what then?

Then there is the problem that there are TOO MANY old people and not enough young people to pay into the SSN system. These old people were from the "Baby Boomer" generation, probably the most successful, wealthy generation in American history. It is because of the failed leadership of these fuckin' Baby Boomers is the reason of the mess in the political and economic system in the nation now.

20. The government of your country tells the truth, the whole truth and nothing but.
The Bush administration has told so many lies that BULLS are dying in masse because they cannot shit anymore. 9/11, Iraq, the economy, the Middle East, Katrina, taxation.


21. Public enterprise is as valued as private enterprise in your country.

If public enterprise means what the government runs, then it is mainly a failure. China is selling off as much public enterprise as they can unload. In the United States, all public enterprises are losing money, citizens monies going down the toilet. It is not the role of government to make money, and it is the role of government to allow it's citizenry to earn income with minimal govt. interference in legal enterprise.

Once I was listening to a radio host, (he's fat, super rich, Oxy-Cotin addict and has the same name as the best band in Canada) ask "NAME SOMETHING THAT THE GOVERNMENT RUNS WELL." The only thing that people could come up with was the military, and especially the Marine Corps. However, military institutions in the USA only run well because individuals have pride in being in them, not because of the state.


22. The courts and police are independent of your country's politicians.

The court system in the United States is burdened down, and is the money making playground of lawyers. Lawyers make up the majority of the politicians at the local, state and federal levels. In most jurisdictions, the office of judge and sheriff are decided by public election.

Police departments in the United States fall under many jurisdictions, local, county, state and federal. Some police departments are better than others, most are overburdened with the crime that they cannot stay on top of. Most cops are good people doing a service. A few are thugs.

23. Trade unions flourish in your country.

Not anymore because the trades have moved offshore to other nations, or former Mexican (invaders) have taken skilled blue collar jobs making 1/2 or less of what American workers used to make. Probably unions are under fire like never before from companies and corporations. I will say that the unions have shot themselves in the foot alot of the time with corrupt leaders, workers making way too much (like auto workers making $40 dollars per hour doing a job a monkey, a Mexican, or a robot could do much cheaper.)

24. Your country aims to make the balance between life at work and life at home a healthy one.

Because of the economy, both husbands and wives have to work to survive to kep up with the bills and taxes. To many people work is life, without work they are out on the street, with companies treating workers like expendible parts. Families in Middle America are shrinking in size, and the divorce rate is going way up.

The American dollar is falling sharply, which causes the prices of goods and services to go up, but without the cost of living increases (hey, you make too much money, Pedro can do it for 1/2 as you can.). The American dollar is called FIAT, which means that it has no value of its own, outside of what the government says that it's worth. Those who control the money, and the printing of it thereof, controls the economy. This comes from the Federal Reserve, which is a PRIVATE bank, that does not work for the good of the common American, and quite the opposite.

The United States has borrowed $400,000,000,000 dollars from the CHINESE to finance the Iraq massacre. $400 Billion. This is like giving every Chinese citizen 2000 RMB apiece! All ex-pats, look out your windows and see the new construction going on. The Chinese have taken this money, have generously lended out at interest which partially fuels the economy here.

Most Americans are too busy working, and too damned tired to care. They cant do shit about it, and how does one person change things?

25. Aspirations are achievable by all your country's people.

Many people have different aspirations, and we are not all the same. I do not aspire for much. As long as I have my wife, my little teaching job, smoke, and food in my belly I am OK. Some people are go getters who make "goals" for themselves.
---------------------------------------------------

There you have it. You asked.

Senor

"I take a shit for freedom since no one else gives a shit."

I was in Singapore for the last few days.

But, I've never had so many people (all Chinese) cut in front of me and demand service before me. After getting quite frustrated and asking around, I was told that the Chinese in Singapore consider themselves superior to westerners (perhaps partly because I  was not well dressed or well groomed) and superior to Chinese from Malaysia for example. They don't have to wait for others - they can go first even if you got their first.

I live in Singapore (and have so for a few years) so maybe I can shed a bit of light on all this.
The "cutting in line" in my experience is rather rare in Singapore. It hasn't happened to me at all. Used to happen all the time in PRC.

As for "service", well yes, it does happen. You said you were not well groomed or dressed. That is very important in Singapore and the rest of Asia. In my experience in Singapore, you get far more respect if you're well dressed. Service is also more attentive and prompter.

Today for example I had to go and buy some ink for my parents' printer. I was dressed in a singlet, a dirty old pair of shorts and an old pair of tatty skating shoes. Needless to say that the service I got was rather poor. The guy behind the cashier counter disappeared to pack some TVs into boxes when I was expecting him to help a customer (me). I gave him 5 minutes and politely reminded him that I was waiting. He gave me some BS excuse about how they were understaffed and apologised. Charged me for the ink and cables and sent me on my way.

As for the superiority issue, again I think that happens. It happens to me sometimes (by all races, not just Chinese) but I dont take  . You just have to confront whoever it is and ask them who the f*ck do they think they are. As they have traditional asian values and don't want to lose face they will apologise profusely and back down.

I've lived in Singapore for a while. I like it but it does have its fair share of pompous, superior than thou morons. You just have to keep them in line when they step over it.