Raoul's China Saloon (V5.0) Beta
The Bar Room => The BS-Wrestling Pit => Topic started by: Ben-Dan on November 25, 2010, 03:24:25 PM
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This is just a pet peeve of mine. I hate it when people say, "This is China." It usually reflects some sort of all-encompassing negative projection onto China, and then a rubric in which the listener has to accept it as it is or be vanquished.
When I first moved to China I had a really shitty apartment. It had, as a Chinese friend described it, 3 problems: 1) It's old. 2) It's ugly. 3) It's broken. My apartment was the bleakest dwelling I'd ever had the displeasure to enter. Grease completely covered the windows in the kitchen, the floor was black around all the edges, it reeked of cigarette smoke, the toilet was sunk in the floor and surrounded by a puddle, the furniture was all the cheapest possible variety (and broken), and a single bare bulb hung from the ceiling by a cord in the "living room".
When I complained about this, I would here things like, "This is China." My response would be, "Yes, and in my apartment building, the other apartments are MUCH nicer. They have real curtains and not Snoopy pull down blinds. They have wooden furniture and not just plastic chairs and one rickety rusted metal chair." Indeed, there were plenty of plush apartments, and I had absolutely the worst unit in my apartment complex.
When I objected to some unfair situation at work, another teacher (who was basically a good guy) would often say, "This is China, it's not your job to change it." My gut reaction was I didn't like being told I was powerless and must acquiesce. A little part of my mind up and said, "FUCK THAT! I'm not just going to TAKE IT!" I like to think I have some power and control over my life, even if I live in China, and I can steer things to my advantage. So, when we were told we had to work one weekend because of protests, for example, my friend dutifully went to his classes and I bailed out and took a trip. I didn't have to accept it and there weren't any repercussions. And if there had been, as Socrates famously said, "The unknown is always preferable to a known evil."
Sometimes people will pull out the "This is China" card if I express disgust at some behavior like hawking goobers on the floor in restaurants. Even Chinese people can't stand people cutting in line in front of them, for example, so if I can't stand it I don't need to be told, "This is China."
lastly, I resent the "This is China" statement, because it also implies the speaker knows more about China than I do and can express exactly what China is, as if it were so easily any one implacable thing. There's also the two-fold condescension, that the listener has less of a grasp on China and reality in general, and the arrogance of simplifying China and Chinese as intractably behind.
China is an extremely large and disparate place, and no one label or utterance encompasses all of it. Some cities don't allow honking, for example, while in others not-honking is tantamount to a celibate life. Dege is completely different from Lanzhou which is completely different from Yangshuo which is completely different from Xi'an… There are "no spitting" signs posted in the city I live in, so how is it not accepting China to find spitting disgusting when there are signs posted saying is unhygienic and disgusting.
When someone says, "This is China," I want to say back, "This is the Milky Way." [in other words, don't pigeon hole China and me in it.]
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This is our test lab. Now run through the maze like a good mouse and we might give you some cheese. xxxxxxxxxx
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excellent excellent rant
it applies to chinese and western thinking about china
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I'm a feisty gal, so I don't accept bad behavior. Does that mean I'm imposing my American values on random Chinese people that exhibit bad manners? I don't think so. Don't cut in line and I won't lecture you about bad manners. Don't honk your horn like a lunatic while playing chicken with little old ladies on four lane highways and I won't yell at you. Simple.
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I guess this is in response to what I said about being watched in China on the surveillance thread. I mean it is fine to not like certain things about China Ben-Dan, but there are certain things you really can't change. Saying "f-you, I'm not going to stand for that" everytime you run up against some aspect of life in China that you find distasteful might work sometimes, but certainly not all the time, and sometimes could possibly even backfire completely. You have to choose your battles. I don't see what's so awful about aknowledging that this is a different culture with different rules and that while we may not like those rules we shouldn't be surprised if no one goes out of their way to change them on our behalf.
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My hubby hates it when students say "We Chinese...." followed by some general statement because he say it leads to over generalizations. (Especially as two students will contradict themselves often times and we don't know who/what to believe!)
But then I have to remind him that we say "in America we..." or even worse, "In western culture we..." and then we proceed to generalize half of the planet. Especially as he teaches culture class which is basically built on generalizations and explaining our culture in a few sound bites.
What I'm getting at is even though it is a pet peeve of yours, it is just something people say when there isn't really much else to say. I'm mean really, you see someone spit a giant loogey in front of you and you complain about it out loud even I might respond with "this is china" because really, what else is there to say? (except maybe, "yep--that's gross.")
Anyway, I don't think it is meant to put you down and imply you know less than the speaker. I don't read that into it when people tell me that either. It's more just a response to a situation that you are upset about that the other person isn't is the way I see it.
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IMO, "This is China" is equal to "Well, (shrug) what can you do?"
Not "Aren't you aware of the obvious, you newbie twit?"
But yeah, I pick my battles. Right now, my campaign is for the availability of butter in my town.
But, good on ya for fighting the good fight!
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This is China means:
You are in a taxi and about 500 yards from the intersection. Your green light has only 7 seconds before it changes. By some miracle, your driver not only makes it through, he doesn't kill or maim anyone.
Then at the next intersection, you are only 50 yards away with a minute 20. And yet, you end up waiting for the next green light. He didn't make it because he was too slow
mmmmmmmmmm
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But yeah, I pick my battles. Right now, my campaign is for the availability of butter in my town.
When I lived in a small, butter-less town years ago, a "western-style" bakery opened. Yeah, they had to have butter to make some of the stuff they baked (badly). I just asked the manager if I could buy a hunk of their better (after buying a bag full of their baked shyte. He agreed and I had a butter supplier.
Try one of the myriad of local bake shops that have sprung up everywhere in even the smallest of towns. Become a good customer and ask them if you can buy some of their butter every now and then. TIC, it should work. bfbfbfbfbf
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This is China means: He didn't make it because he was too slow
These guys have never even considered using second gear.
They lug their engines constantly. Drives me batty!
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FYI we get the same thing here - local variant is "Only in Israel" and is applied to positive and negatives alike.For example by coincidence the person you sit next to on a long journey turns out to be a relative of a student (or similar thing- since the whole country is tiny, only 7 mill people everyone is related to everyone) or alternatively in the negative version you get screwed by some government official with some bureaucratic bungle. Everyone thinks that these things only happen in "their" country. In fact these things happen everywhere. I think the inflection of the phrase some kind of love-hate relationship with the place you call home.It's like the way you relate to a wayward but beloved uncle- he has foibles but you forgive him cos he is so adorable and dear to you.
Does that make any sense?
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This is China translates to 'shut the fuck up, you are boring me with your constant whining'
I agree it can be annoying because it's passive aggressive and delivered with a smile.
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This is just a pet peeve of mine.
You seem to have a lot of pets.
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What do you mean Ben-Dan?
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What do you mean Ben-Dan?
what do you mean what do I mean? Not sure what you're addressing. Sure, there are a lot of little things that annoy me, and some big ones. It's an imperfect world and a lot of it's, well, if I had to grade it: failing.
Oh, if you mean what else came to mind? Hairdressers. They seem to have some sort of license to harass foreigners. Had a group of them calling out stuff to me this morning, "where you going?," shit like that. Coming back the same way I crossed the street to avoid them, without ever looking at them or acknowledging them, and they were yelling at me from across the street.
That and the two people who cut in front of me in line at KFC when I was trying to get a coffee to go.
But, I wasn't going to go into that stuff. It's pretty typical. Non-stop actually. All part of the big picture.
Well ....... wait for it ........ This is China
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Lighten up, kiddies. bibibibibi
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When I was in the lift at the Casino the other day,I could hardly believe my eyes. aoaoaoaoao There, in the corner, was this huge goober (pile of SPIT) bibibibibi Guess what I thought? TIFC!!!! ahahahahah ahahahahah ahahahahah
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Last night I took the gf out to dinner. 4 dishes of really good food...I was so stuffed I could hardly walk afterwards..total price was 32 Yuan...22 hours of work a week, all classes end by 15.20, no rent, beautiful scenery, ordering books from Amazon.cn is faster and way cheaper than Amazon.com....TIFC indeed...a few strange habits can't really spoil the big picture...spitting goobers..hah! Try encountering a bunch of addled Swedes with their gobs full of chewing tobacco, then you will see goobers...No indoor heating...nothing a good, warm set of thermo-underwear won't solve...bought groceries at the farmers market, two huge bags of veggies, fruit, tofu, rice and meat cost me around 50 Yuan, don't even want to try to think of the small fortune it would have cost me in Denmark...China has, all in all, way too many good things for a few insignificant bothersome habits to deserve any notice... agagagagag agagagagag agagagagag
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I don't want to get too off topic, but I LOVE my 4th tier tiny boonies of a town. akakakakak
Seriously, I do love this city with all it's burgerless, staring and pointing, kids going poo right next to where you are eating, and goobers everywhere. Love, love, love. (But to love doesn't mean I think everything is perfect, that is just silly.)
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Absolutely...the only perfect aspect of aforementioned village is me agagagagag agagagagag
China is nice...I just the coffee was cheaper agagagagag agagagagag
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^ Your city must be a bit cleaner than mine. I'd almost not believe my eyes if I looked around anywhere and didn't find a goober, or at least a dried up one.
Your TIFC is a good example of one that wouldn't have bothered me at all.
Ben-Dan, I live in Brisbane Australia. agagagagag I was just having a joke. bfbfbfbfbf ahahahahah
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TIFC indeed.
Girls in China wear short shorts all the time, even in winter. Except now the wear them over their longjohns/hose/stockings/whatever. Now by itself, that is not a TIFC momment, but yesterday was. I saw a girl's very short shorts and they were down filled (poofy and puffy) And black leatards (sp?) beneath them
First thing I thought? Indeed, TIFC
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I'll admit that I've personally spit on the street a few times, and I'm in the class-act country of Murrica. I know it varies wildly from place to place, but if you see people do it, in, say, a second-tier city in central China, have some of those people been female? Not, of course, that I'm trying to find out if I can loog freely or anything . . . ;)
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have some of those people been female?
Come and join your sisters in China! Here you can:
1. spend 10 minutes in the bathroom, when you get up in the mornng, tuning up for the day by producing racking coughs that will clear her lungs of phlegm
2. walk down the street and goob left or right with complete freedom. The more socially conscious will aim in the general direction of the gutter
3. in those restaurants where cigarettes are extinguished on the floor, along with any any bones from meat or fish, expectoration is almost mandatory
There is only one sight more spectacular than a vivid orange sunset in China and that is a beautiful girl,immaculately dressed, standing at a bus stop and picking her nose.
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There is only one sight more spectacular than a vivid orange sunset in China and that is a beautiful girl,immaculately dressed, standing at a bus stop and picking her nose.
Can't remember if I've mentioned this before,but it makes me smile when I think about a similar situation here in Oz. Same manner of dress and very attractive Chinese lass sitting at the meal table at the Casino picking her nose and wiping it on the serviette. I must admit though that she did in fact put her free hand over her nose in a similar manner to the way in which the mouth is covered by some when they pick their teeth. aoaoaoaoao ahahahahah You should have seen the look on the face of the waitress when she had to pick up the used serviettes. It also made the (previously admiring) males do a rethink as well. ahahahahah bfbfbfbfbf
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How do you know who's female and who's male here? I mean, I guess people like Granny are female, and I guess the Duke is male. But what's with these little icons that look like an attempt to depict an erect penis or a set of drooping balls?
And why the hell is gender relevant to the identity of the poseur (sp?) anyway?
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Here's an easy way, blue symbol boy, pink symbol girl.
Now if it was only as easy to tell some of the Chinese apart with the girls having boys haircuts and holding hands all the time bibibibibi
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How do you know who's female and who's male here? I mean, I guess people like Granny are female, and I guess the Duke is male. But what's with these little icons that look like an attempt to depict an erect penis or a set of drooping balls?
And why the hell is gender relevant to the identity of the poseur (sp?) anyway?
I guess it doesn't matter all that much, but sometimes you want to refer to someone as a he/she and be able to do it accurately. It also helps when talking about relationships to have a bit of context.
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Ah the memories. Several of us crashed at a friend's house after a looooong day partying once. Early in the morning, a smoking hot Chinese girl in the group stepped out onto the balcony to do her morning phlegm spewing. An American friend who had been in China a lot longer commented something along the lines of, "No matter how beautiful a Chinese girls is, I'm always impressed when she can hock up half a lung."
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bkbkbkbkbk axaxaxaxax
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And why the hell is gender relevant to the identity of the poseur (sp?) anyway?
From my perspective, it comes down to the fact that, as a general rule,(yeah! I'm trying to be nice) men see things differently from women. Sometimes I check for a pink or a blue thing, to see where an opinion is coming from. bfbfbfbfbf Well I did have six brothers you know. ahahahahah ahahahahah
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yeah you see GM, at the beginning when I came on here I wanted to stay genderless (cause I didn't think it was relevant to my postings) but Bossman RD convinced me that people should know my gender so they can reply appropriately. Still not sure it was the right call though.
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Just because I want to strip you naked and do unspeakably perverted acts with you doesn't mean that I don't respect you as a person. ahahahahah
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Piglet
Ignore EL, he is just being silly EL. There was a time when we didn't have the markers for male-female. The original saloon had them but when version 3 first started, I had to beg and plead to get them back in this version.
Trust me when I say it is actually important that we know if it is a man or woman we are talking to. Some comments made by a woman would be treated as a nasty comment if made by a man and of course vice versa. It made some for some very uncomfortable moments on the saloon. Thank goodness to Noles and Raoul, we got the markers back.
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I reckon you got yourself an interesting thesis subject there, Dragonsaver.
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Just because I want to strip you naked and do unspeakably perverted acts with you doesn't mean that I don't respect you as a person. ahahahahah
Piglet,EL has given us enough info to know where that wishful thinking has come from. uuuuuuuuuu ahahahahah bfbfbfbfbf Now if that same message came from me,what would you think? aoaoaoaoao Would you think differently if I called myself Grandpa Marty? akakakakak
Not that the comment was nasty EL, actually it could be rather funny fun. Whoa! time for Granny to shut up before her imagination causes damage to her crook heart. ahahahahah bgbgbgbgbg
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don't worry Granny I am sure that EL would rush to give you mouth to mouth resuscitation
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bkbkbkbkbk axaxaxaxax
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don't worry Granny I am sure that EL would rush to give you mouth to mouth resuscitation
And then I'd work my way down and give Granny Mae a few more experiences to liven up her heart. bhbhbhbhbh
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Do you guys want a private room?
Can we watch (for scientific purposes only of course) afafafafaf
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EL, you're engaged to be married, and yet you still have the women lining up to have heart attacks just so you'll give'em mouth to mouth (to wherever). <sigh> some guys just have it all.
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Can we watch (for scientific purposes only of course) afafafafaf
I don't mind Day Dreamer, provided you get me a video (is that the right term today?) of it bfbfbfbfbf. Who knows EL, we might make a fortune here. We could sell the video rights. I can see it now! uuuuuuuuuu I wonder if Hollywood would make it into a drama or a comedy? aoaoaoaoao ahahahahah
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Can we watch (for scientific purposes only of course) afafafafaf
I don't mind Day Dreamer, provided you get me a video (is that the right term today?) of it bfbfbfbfbf. Who knows EL, we might make a fortune here. We could sell the video rights. I can see it now! uuuuuuuuuu I wonder if Hollywood would make it into a drama or a comedy? aoaoaoaoao ahahahahah
I was thinking of an educational series. The Kama Sutra in 479 easy lessons. bhbhbhbhbh
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I was thinking of an educational series. The Kama Sutra in 479 easy lessons. bhbhbhbhbh
EL, I just got out a book that my brother gave me which was translated from Sanskrit originals by Indra Sinha. It's ok though,because I've written inside that it was his book. This is for when I fall off the perch and my son finds it and his mind goes into overdrive. aoaoaoaoao aoaoaoaoao apapapapap. But I digress! EL, I have had a hip replacement you know and the other one needs doing, but the Doctor doesn't want to have to do the extra paper work if I keel over during the surgery. kkkkkkkkkk Apart from these problems from my misspent youth, my heart would probably give out. alalalalal Sorry mate,but I'd have to give that one a miss after studying the first few positions. 479 easy lessons? Perhaps if they made it into a comedy? ahahahahah ahahahahah ahahahahah
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Is your translation something like this? ahahahahah
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/mistranslations.png)
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6 brothers, Granny? Are we related? I have 5 brothers (and 6 sisters).
Maybe that's why I have no manners and talk to people just the same way regardless of their gender.... ahahahahah
PS, I'm still getting the hang of these icon things and I have no idea what most of them mean.
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Is your translation something like this? ahahahahah
Hehehehe! That's pretty good EL. bfbfbfbfbf I'll bet Piglet didn't anticipate that her statement would lead down the Kama Sutra garden Path. ahahahahah ahahahahah
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6 brothers, Granny? Are we related? I have 5 brothers (and 6 sisters).
G'day Paul. Did your Mum or Dad ever spend time in Australia? uuuuuuuuuu ahahahahah ahahahahah
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Is your translation something like this? ahahahahah
Hehehehe! That's pretty good EL. bfbfbfbfbf I'll bet Piglet didn't anticipate that her statement would lead down the Kama Sutra garden Path. ahahahahah ahahahahah
I think Piglet is figuring out that any conversation involving the two of us is always only 1 or 2 posts away from taking an interesting turn. afafafafaf
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That's right EL I am finally understanding how appropriate your moniker is
bhbhbhbhbh.And Paul I have no clue what these icons mean either. I just choose the ones I like the look of ahahahahah