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Author Topic: Another newbie thread is born  (Read 691 times)
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eggcluck
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« on: September 01, 2011, 10:17:14 PM »

First off, I want to say hi!  th_bi

Naturally I am doing the highly original thing and posting about acquiring teaching jobs, I have enjoyed what little teachign I have done and would like to pursue it as serious career option( so it there are any schools with career development...point me the direction)!

I just want to check what I have picked up so far gleaning this forum has been understood correctly plus a few questions of my own.

What I think I have understood from reading this forum is :-

1, Never use recruiters
2, Do not accept a job with EF
3, Expected wage is qround 5000-8000 RMB plus flights and accomdation.
4, Most employers help with relocation and red tape so I can safely ignore those that do not.
5, Take bad reviews with a grain of salt
6, Ignore good reviews
7, Dont bother with post a CV websites ( sadly I already done this one ^^).

Now you mind has been suitably numbed by my list I shall inject the newbie questions:-

I posted my CVs on the 5th of august and got bombarded (now it is just a trickle of 1 or 2 a week) but I fell ill and my in-box gathered dust and I have now only just restarted, I noticed they were all for September starts, have a missed the boat is is job hunting for a start this year still possible? Would some of those old sender be happy to hear from me or are they only now suitable for the rubbish bin.

The pay and benifits seem pretty much identical across the board to me, so they vary only on institution and location. With the institution apparently being a lottery draw I have a question about location. I want to be within easy/cheap reach of Japan for hopefully many weekd excursiosn etc what would be a good location for this?
« Last Edit: September 01, 2011, 10:41:05 PM by eggcluck » Logged

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Granny Mae
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« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2011, 10:34:04 PM »

G'day eggcluck and welcome. Why don't you pop over to the Champagne Cabana and go to the Introductions section. I'd love to hear about you and I know others would as well. th_ag I'll leave it to the people who will know what advice to give you on the questions you have asked. th_bf
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Raoul F. Duke
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« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2011, 10:46:57 PM »

Willkommen bienvenu welcome, Eggcluck! th_ag

Learn well you have, young Paduan. th_bf

Let me add a few minor corrections...

Quote
Do not accept a job with EF
Definitely add AES/Aston and Kids Castle to that list, and be wary of other chain English mills.

Quote
Expected wage is qround 5000-8000 RMB plus flights and accomdation.
Often true of private schools. However, at many universities more like 4000 is often still standard...and these can still be perfectly good jobs. th_bf
Well, by China standards, anyway... th_bi

Quote
Ignore good reviews
Don't ignore them; many are quite valid. Just be wary of them...sometimes good "reviews" are posted by the schools themselves, or by expat teachers who have become their running dogs. Try to find as many reviews as possible, and take the big picture.

Otherwise, you seem to have the ol' noggin on pretty straight so far. th_bf
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we're building the corrupt, incompetent, baijiu-swilling buttheads of tomorrow!" (Raoul F. Duke)
ericthered
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« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2011, 11:51:16 PM »

Hi there...not too sure about the whole avoid CV websites..I posted my CV on one in 2008 and ended up getting a nice, rewarding uni job.
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The Local Dialect
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« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2011, 12:06:10 AM »

I don't know about weekend excursions to Japan. No matter how close you are, you generally have to fly (the only other option is a boat which pretty slow), and air tickets to Japan are pretty expensive, expensive enough that going frequently is pretty impractical unless money isn't a concern. You could also easily spend a month's Chinese salary in one weekend in Japan.
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Just Like Mr Benn
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« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2011, 12:08:40 AM »

There are good EF schools. It depends on your circumstances, experience, personality etc. On the other hand, some, perhaps most, EF schools might be a nightmare for anybody.

Anyway, the restrictions that you've outlines, although they may result in your missing out on some good jobs / school, will limit your risk of bad experiences. It's not as if a job with EF is ever going to be the only good option.
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Escaped Lunatic
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« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2011, 02:12:05 AM »

If you can live without Japan, southern China has its charms.  My area of Guangdong has easy access to HK and Macao.  Some provinces share borders with some entertaining places.
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china-matt
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« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2011, 05:03:35 AM »

Something interesting from Shanghaiist: Shanghai-Nagasaki ferry service starting in November. http://shanghaiist.com/2011/09/01/shanghai_-_nagasaki_passenger_ferry.php

As for the mention of ignoring good reviews, you should look at them the same as you would negative reviews. Sometimes people have genuinely rewarding experiences, however, schools in China can change course rapidly. The grad school I taught at in Shenzhen is still doing well--same great boss is still there, but most of the support staff has departed (they were wonderful).
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Raoul F. Duke
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« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2011, 06:50:46 AM »

Hi there...not too sure about the whole avoid CV websites..I posted my CV on one in 2008 and ended up getting a nice, rewarding uni job.

The reason I (and apparently others) recommend avoiding these is that they tend to make one a magnet for recruiters. A lot of people who post CVs on these sites find themselves hounded to death by every recruiter and other such EFL lowlife in China. th_as

There are also security issues. Posting personal info- even e-mail addresses- in a publicly-accessible site can create real problems for people. I don't recommend ever doing that...even here. th_k  There are other ways to skin this cat that don't involve posting personal info in public sites.

But this is a general suggestion. You, Squirrel-boy, should be pasting your photo and all kinds of personal information all over the internet. This goes double for sites based in Eastern Europe, Russia, and Sub-Saharan Africa. th_u th_ah

There are good EF schools. It depends on your circumstances, experience, personality etc.

Absolutely. And most rivers have gold nuggets somewhere on the bottom, too. However, the odds of you actually finding  either of these are incredibly remote. And in the case of EF, the consequences of NOT finding one of those rare decent schools are so dire that I recommend simply giving the whole thing a miss. As you yourself point out, there's an abundance of options that don't involve EF at all...or AES/Aston, Kids Castle, or any other of these bottom-of-the-barrel McEnglish mills. th_a

I'd also submit that one's experience at an EF school probably has a lot more to do with the integrity of the management than with one's own personal qualities. If you're a flake, you're probably going to have problems anywhere you work...but you can be a perfectly nice person and still get badly burned at these places. th_bj

Meanwhile, I totally agree with TLD on "weekend excursions" to Japan. It's just not going to be feasible very often, no matter where in China you locate. Even if you can find reasonably-priced transport, you're likely to find that a Chinese teacher's salary may not even get you out of the airport in Japan. You wanna see Japan? Work there and hope to get a salary that will let you keep up with the cost of living there. Otherwise, I'm pretty sure you'll find more than plenty of see-and-do opportunities in China. You can also visit a lot of Southeast Asian countries quite cheaply from China. th_bf
But Japan, the land of the US $30 tomato? No way. A save-for-months excursion at best.

Also...well, you'd better hurry, but you can probably still get some university jobs for this academic year. There's bound to be a few schools out there with unfilled slots or no-shows. However, on this basis you probably won't be able to pick and choose locations...and again, you really need to hurry to have a shot at anything reasonable. th_o
« Last Edit: September 02, 2011, 07:10:34 AM by Raoul F. Duke » Logged

"Vicodin and dumplings...it's a great combination!" (Anthony Bourdain, in Harbin)

"Here in China we aren't just teaching...
we're building the corrupt, incompetent, baijiu-swilling buttheads of tomorrow!" (Raoul F. Duke)
Raoul F. Duke
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« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2011, 11:10:46 AM »

My apologies; I have removed a post from this thread due to some seriously misleading advice contained within. I genuinely hate to resort to such measures, and have done so relatively rarely, but there are times when I am presented with little choice. th_bi
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"Vicodin and dumplings...it's a great combination!" (Anthony Bourdain, in Harbin)

"Here in China we aren't just teaching...
we're building the corrupt, incompetent, baijiu-swilling buttheads of tomorrow!" (Raoul F. Duke)
Mimi
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« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2011, 04:34:59 PM »

In regards to not posting a CV on a website, I'm of mixed opinion.  That is how I got 2 out of my 3 jobs, and the only one I didn't get that way was through a recruiter (and was the worst year of my life so far - but I've had a pretty good life). 

However, something weird has happened over the past few months.  I guess a few recruiters have taken my CV and are advertising it to schools who decide to bypass the recruiter and call the number listed - my cell number.  I can't even tell you how many calls I've gotten asking when I'm available to start working.  I'm a little pissed off about it.
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The Local Dialect
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« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2011, 05:10:55 PM »

I posted my CV to one of those sites back when I was looking for my first job ever and I ended up with nothing but literally years and years of spam to my inbox until I eventually stopped using that email address.
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Paul
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« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2011, 11:51:05 AM »

As I don't know how to reply to a closed thread I'll ask the question here:

Real names, real photos, Raoul?  I accept the fact that I'm not very photogenic but I'd hesitate before I start posting pics of Brad Pitt and my wife....

Hey Paul,
Sometimes I close off threads to keep them from getting cluttered up, so they can remain on the desired point. However, in this particular case, I closed it mainly because it never occurred to me that there would be questions arising on the given subject. Obviously I was wrong, so I'll open that thread back up.

Meanwhile, there are always other ways to ask questions. One of the best is to send a PM to me or another Admin or Moderator, or to send me an e-mail at yochinaraoul@yahoo.com.
In general we ask that closed threads STAY closed, and that one not simply open a new thread on the same subject. However, this particular topic is just regarding general info on how to use The Saloon; in such a case there's always our "Questions/Issues/Suggestions About The Saloon" board, and you're always welcome to start a thread and ask a question on such matters there.

One thing we ask you NOT do is to co-opt another person's thread- especially an on-topic one- to pop in such a question. -R


« Last Edit: September 05, 2011, 11:07:00 AM by Raoul F. Duke » Logged
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« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2011, 12:06:17 PM »

As I don't know how to reply to a closed thread....

You canNOT.  Closed / Locked Threads are only accessible to Moderators.

... I accept the fact that I'm not very photogenic but I'd hesitate before I start posting pics of Brad Pitt and my wife....

Brad Pitt's photo should be OK.  One of our Lady Members has a pix of Kiefer Sutherland as her avatar, since she's such a fan of his.
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eggcluck
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« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2011, 07:43:14 PM »

Thankyou for the help,

In reagard to the questions about Japan, I mentioned it because I would like to see both coutnries at somepoint. As for getting a job there since I was already learning Japanese I did start a search there but after sending 300 applications over a period or 2 months and not even getting a "no thankyou" and unreliable odd ball language exchange partners it has left me a little jaded towards that country, though still wanting to vist.

To me China is just as interesting, and the things that keep my mind entertained are probably more abundant in China (game of go/wei que anyone? Tongue).

The vancies that I see/are sent to me seem ot be devoid on any info about the net anywhere about them, so for my first job (no experience = cant be picky?) when I get it I will be rolling the dice. Hopefully no news is good news in this instance!

p.s I do not find shared accomdation such a repulsive idea, I think it is a great way to build up that intial social circle, that I I ahve been in shared accomdation for all my life bar 6 months ^^
« Last Edit: September 04, 2011, 07:53:19 PM by eggcluck » Logged

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