Canucks fail test

MOP you really need to get a life.  I will not let you turn this thread into a fight.

And that's why you're in with the personal insults already and defending of the stereotyping individuals based on national origin. 

Every nationality has it's stereotypes. Unfortunately there are just enough people that fit each stereotype to make it difficult to state that the stereotype is totally wrong.  After all - that's why they arose in the first place.

Substitute race and ethnicity for nationality. What is the difference?

Minority opinion does not speak for the majority fact, but it is shockign that it comes from people who teach history, and had I posted the same thing Eagle said but changed it to be about Canadians, I'd bet a few people would be jumping all over me. Call it a hunch.

But the rest of us are also aware that many, many, many, more people don't fit that image.

Thank goodness.

Think of the stereotypes of Aussies.

Bronzed, beer-drinking, meat-pie eating, (real)football-loving, slow-talking etc etc.

Did a government broadcaster finance hours of programming making fun of that - in a nation that wasn't Australia  and passed it off as truth?

But there is no need to get stirred up about it - I laugh when people tell me I am (or am not) typical.  I invoke the typicality when I feel like it.  "I'm Australian, of course I can drink beer/swim/play tennis" "I'm Australian, of course I grew up riding horses" etc.  Not every Australian can or does do these things (and my tennis is terrible!!), and we all know that logically.

I'd laugh about it if the bogus stereotyeps weren't utter fabrications re-inforced by state financed media (i. e. the CBC..... and weren't thrown out with the verocity of an ephithet.

But it is easy to get defensive about the negative sides of stereotypicality, and unfortunately, it is impossible to say it NEVER happens or has happened.

Inversely, it's impossible to say that it is not unfair, unjust, and a sign of poor character.

Make people lose the image by your own actions.

I'd like to think that, but when it's laid out as "guilty until proven innocent," the odds are against you, since individuals who subscribe to such stereotypes will find truth to them in the most innocuous of actions.

I strongly suspect if I had posted what Eagle posted but changed the nationalities I'd have people jumping down my throat.

Substitute race and ethnicity for nationality. What is the difference?

  None at all.  I've met just enough alcoholic Aborigines to say that SOME of them meet the stereoptype. I've met just enough "whinging Poms" to say that SOME of them meet the stereotype, and I can say it about almost any nationality I have met.

Did a government broadcaster finance hours of programming making fun of that - in a nation that wasn't Australia  and passed it off as truth?

For heaven's sake YES!! The British did it to us "colonials' for a 100 years!!  Just have a look at some of the British BBC programs that poke fun of every nation they ever invaded.  Blimey!!

I'd laugh about it if the bogus stereotyeps weren't utter fabrications re-inforced by state financed media (i. e. the CBC..... and weren't thrown out with the verocity of an ephithet.

I think in the end we ended up being secure enough that we started to take a sort of perverse pride in some of the negative stereotypes that the Brits promoted. (And we got our revenge by sending them Barry McKenzie, Edna Everage, Kylie Minogue and Rolf Harris!)  The Australian Government also funds programs with these stereotypes.

I strongly suspect if I had posted what Eagle posted but changed the nationalities I'd have people jumping down my throat.

This one I think depends on the nationality being mentioned. As an Aussie I would have decried the poverty of my education system, noted that there were people who had never crossed a particular bridge in their home town, but maybe in our defence, brought up stats to show that we were one of the most travelled nationalities around, thereby demonstrating a willingness to be 'citizens of the world". 

MOP - NO-ONE is having a go at you!! Have a beer and calm down!

 (And we got our revenge by sending them Barry McKenzie, Edna Everage, Kylie Minogue and Rolf Harris!)

but not MENTAL AS ANYTING ?

The Australian Government also funds programs with these stereotypes.

Do tell. I'd like to know.

MOP - NO-ONE is having a go at you!! Have a beer and calm down!

Thanks. I might have a cold one in a bit.

I would ahve found Eagle's statemetn jsut as offensive had it been about Oz, and NZ, Canada and Mexico, etc. I've mentioend my views on nationalism in another thread and while I view nationalism as an extension of primitive territorialism, I also view denigrating people from regions of the world in blanket, patently false statements (that may have been thrown out with a degree of seriousness) equally primitive.

I guess I was raised strange: love a person for hte person. Hate a person for their individual actions, and try to see the forrest for the trees about groups. Bad apples don't always ruin a "bunch," and as you've made clear - they don't represent the whole, either.

Anyway, thanks for the beer and I'll hit the fridge now. Sadly it only has Sam Adams pilfered from leftovers of a wrap party, but it'll do.

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The Australian Government also funds programs with these stereotypes.

Do tell. I'd like to know.

Most Australian comedy that is REALLY good is funded by the Oz government through the ABC.  'Kath and Kim', 'Australia you're standing in it', 'The Election Chaser', 'Frontline' ... the list is endless.  'The Adventures of Barry McKenzie' was one of the early films totally funded by this government established and funded body.

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The Australian Government also funds programs with these stereotypes.

Do tell. I'd like to know.

Most Australian comedy that is REALLY good is funded by the Oz government through the ABC.  'Kath and Kim', 'Australia you're standing in it', 'The Election Chaser', 'Frontline' ... the list is endless.  'The Adventures of Barry McKenzie' was one of the early films totally funded by this government established and funded body.

I meant programs that reinforce stereotypes of other nations, as in their entire existence is predicated upon belitting another nation. Such is the case with what I witnessed with THIS HOUR HAS 22 MINUTES/TALKING TO AMERICANS (a small part of the former and a bigger part of the later) a few years back.

a trivial aside: KATH & KIM runs on either the Independent Film Channel or the Sundance Channel in the States. I'm familiar with the first Barry McKenzie film but will try to pretend the Dame Edna schtick doesn't exist. I'm still partial to the Norman Gunston character portrayed by Garry McDonald: comedy gold. That character was a precursor to what Sasha Baron Coen has been doing internationally.

We had one of these citizenship tests too. First it was declared to be too difficult, then 99% of the people who took it passed and then the nationalist right-wing, racist party got all up in arms and criticized it for being too easy...even though few days earlier they defended the opinion that it was too difficult

As for stereotypes, I agree. Why is it that everyone thinks Scandinavians are tall, blond and blue-eyed?? Well, I mean, the good looking ones are, no doubt about that. It just makes me very, very angry!!! And why is it that people think red-haired folk have uncontrollable tempers...makes me really angry too..err...
Stereotypical Dane: Belongs to the happiest people on Earth. Likes to drink beer. Gets very angry about taxes, likes to complain about the weather and is either 1)blond, 2)blue-eyed, 3)pale or a combination of these. Having blue eyes and being ridiculously pale, I live up to these stereotypes. So, beer on me now, lets discuss the many ways we hate rain and why taxes suck and make fun of how people from Jutland talk.

Moonie, not saying all or even many Usanians but about 10 years ago a couple of guys from S. Carolina asked a friend and I where they could find some good skiing. They had ski racks and looked ready to roll. I thought they were joking but serious they were.

It was an hour south of Toronto in July.

Let's face it, most people from all countries are morons or at least apathetic to the surrounding world.

And why is it that people think red-haired folk have uncontrollable tempers...makes me really angry too..err...

Never, never have a red-haired boyfriend was a warning I grew up with from different relatives...as in never, never - worse people around! You should have seen the fuss when I was living with a red-head!

Barry McKenzie definitely reinforced British stereoptypes of Aussies!!  And Oz stereotypes of the Brits.

I'm glad "Kath and Kim" is getting an airing (my daughters gave me that set and also "John Saffron Takes on God" series for last Christmas - they know me!)- but how much of it has had to be changed?  "The Castle" and other Oz comedies had to be changed quite a bit before they could jump the cultural gap.

But would you seriously contend that American programmers (gov't sponsored ones included) don't reinforce stereotypes of minority groups in America, of Mexicans, Colombians etc etc?  Truly?  Because watching a program like Apocalypto made my Mexican friends ANGRY - their view was that the history was stuffed up and the Mayans didn't come off looking OK as a group either. Even directed by Mel Gibson (a man not known for his tolerance)it was still funded by US business interests convinced enough people would want to see it to make money from it.

We run the military on stereotypes - and Gov'ts of all colours sure as hell reinforce those stereotypes to make it easier to kill 'the other'.  Governments are using 'profiling' to detect 'terrorists' as visa applicants.  What is another name for 'profiling' but stereotyping? 

Governments DO consciously support stereotyping of different groups to gain support for both domestic and foreign policies.  AND the average citizen BUYS it - lock stock and barrel.

We do have to be ware that we don't perpetrate this ourselves.

But - the advice still works - by your actions, change individuals views.  The Japanese teachers here are the ones doing the work to combat the Chinese governments inculcation of stereotyping.  You and I can do it with the negative stereotypes of our countries.

(Although if it means I have to give up drinking - ... maybe I'll keep it a bit longer!)

I'm glad "Kath and Kim" is getting an airing (my daughters gave me that set and also "John Saffron Takes on God" series for last Christmas - they know me!)- but how much of it has had to be changed?  "The Castle" and other Oz comedies had to be changed quite a bit before they could jump the cultural gap.

I don't think they change KATH & KIM. As for THE CASTLE, I blame that on Warner Bros. or whoever its American distributor was.

You are well aware that they ADR'd (Additional Dialogue Redorded) MAD MAX back in the day with American actors - you know - because they assumed folks wouldn't know that a windscreen and a windshield were one in the same 

I literally counted the differences in the dialogue and they totalled 5; all of which would have been easily figured out by anyone confused, simply by context of use!

Really! It took over 25 years before Americans could hear the film with its original, synch sound version. I blame American International Pictures (its distributor at the time) for that. Meanwhile, STONE, from around the same period - was released with its original Oz flavoring (by another distributor).

But would you seriously contend that American programmers (gov't sponsored ones included) don't reinforce stereotypes of minority groups in America, of Mexicans, Colombians etc etc?  Truly?

The government sponsored ones? Nah. In fact, if you google Ken Burns' THE WAR and recsearch the controversy around it, you'll see that they actually made him rework the film because he inadvertantly neglected the entire contribution Latino Americans made in the war effort (WWII). PBS does its best to respect diversity. Heck, SESAME STREET is a PBS production.

We only have one public television channel, and it's relayed through regional offices that decide which of the publically funded programs it will broadcast. It's under so many magnifying glasses from so many political pressure groups that they go out of their way to be all things to all people.

However, the privately owned networks (one of which is owned by an Ozzie - Rupert Murdoch & FOX) are answerable only to adertising dollars and the FCC. The FCC don't enforce fair representation. Just the Geroge Carlin seven dirty words, nudity, graphic violence and a lot of technical specs and licensing that have noting to do with content, for the most part).

Still, that is another can of worms and is a domestic issue veering from the issue at hand.

 

Because watching a program like Apocalypto made my Mexican friends ANGRY - their view was that the history was stuffed up and the Mayans didn't come off looking OK as a group either. Even directed by Mel Gibson (a man not known for his tolerance)it was still funded by US business interests convinced enough people would want to see it to make money from it.

Gibson's company - ICON - has its financing came from Australian, German and American interests, actually. Just pointing out a fact. I also believe an overwhelming majority of Americans didn't see the film. I know I haven't, but I try not to give my money to anti-semites. The premise was interesting.

Governments DO consciously support stereotyping of different groups to gain support for both domestic and foreign policies.  AND the average citizen BUYS it - lock stock and barrel.

That's over simplification of it. Many average citizens in my country can't "buy anything," be it literally or figuratively in the United States. They're too busy trying to stay alive and provide the basics. As the situaton in Iraq, the horrifying, deliberate "let them eat cake" handling of post-Katrina New Orleans, and the recent Scooter Libby fiasco have proven: we don't run our government. It runs us.

Moonie, not saying all or even many Usanians but about 10 years ago a couple of guys from S. Carolina asked a friend and I where they could find some good skiing. They had ski racks and looked ready to roll. I thought they were joking but serious they were.

It was an hour south of Toronto in July.

That's comic gold.

Moonie, not saying all or even many Usanians but about 10 years ago a couple of guys from S. Carolina asked a friend and I where they could find some good skiing. They had ski racks and looked ready to roll. I thought they were joking but serious they were.

It was an hour south of Toronto in July.

Dude!  Is that a true story, 'cause I'm can't stop laughing.  I will be sure to mention it to a good friend of mine from South Carolina. 

Stereotypes make for a good discussion in the classroom as well.  I get all kinds of crazy conceptions from my students.  Koreans seem to agree that Canadians are lazy, Aussies are easygoing and selfish, Irish are always happy and like to get drunk every night, Brits and Japanese are very polite, but totally insincere, and Chinese are not to be trusted and will eat anything. 

Aside from the Irish drinking stereotype, most of these were new and fascinating to me.  Are Canadians really lazy?  Are Aussies really selfish?  It hasn't been true in my experience. 

Yeah well, I was once asked by some American tourists if we had Vikings in reservations. But stereotypes abound whereever you go. Brits have bad teeth, Aussies live off huge slabs of meat, Fosters and carry really big knives, all Americans are like Dirty Harry, Finnish people enjoy two things: drinking and throwing knives, Canadians all speak French, finish their sentences with the word "eh", seem unreasonably antagonistic towards the letter "o" and live in a country where it snows all the time and grizzly bears and beavers run around willy-nilly, all Norwegians can ski before they can walk, Irish people all have red hair and loves to fight and..well..I can't think of anymore examples. Stereotypes are silly and worthless. I don't think I have come across what the stereotypical Dane is supposed to be but whatever it is, I wouldn't care. Stereotypes are funny, if they are meant to be funny, as is the example of the Simpson which is riddled with stereotypes. Then there are morons, like the Danish Neo Nazi schmucks who propogate their not-so-funny and idiotic stereotypes via an illegal radio.

Dude!  Is that a true story, 'cause I'm can't stop laughing.  I will be sure to mention it to a good friend of mine from South Carolina.

Yeah, It's true. My friend gave him directions north, very north.