Z-Visa/Residence Permit/FEC Application in Contract.

Hi Folks,

Is it vitally important for a public university, that there is mention in the "Agreement of Employment"/contract that the public university will apply for a Z visa/Residence Permit/Foreign Expert Certificate on behalf of the teacher.  Obviously, the government contract part cannot be amended so radically.  But, what about the appended "agreement of Employment". Surely, even for a public school/public university, mention can and should be made of the fact that the school will apply for a Z visa/residence permit and foreign expert certificate on my behalf.  Or is it really necessay since it's a public school/university?  Public schools/universities don't fleece people like private schools/universities can.  [sighs]. What's your take?

I posted a copy of an e-mail I got from an FAO officer in a university I'm considering taking a job at. Here:

http://raoulschinasaloon.com/index.php?topic=3819.msg74099#msg74099

He told me that an amendment of the Agreement of Employment is not necessary even by means of an appendix to the Agreement of Employment because he represents a public school, in particular, a public university, so that represents enough credibility on their part that they will process all the documents, Z visa/residence permit/FEC, for me, to the best of their ability.

Do you agree? Is this a red line for some of you? Should I insist that there is mention of the requirement on the part of the Employer/the University to apply for a Z-Visa/Residence Permit and Foreign Expert Certificate in the contract?  I remember before some of you guys were saying how important it is to have this sort of undertaking given on the part of the educational establishment *in writing*.  But, perhaps, you meant private schools and unis and not public schools and unis.

In a way, this FAO officer, in fairness to him, has given me an undertaking *in writing* by sending me the e-mails as you can see in the other thread I reference above. [sighs].

What should I do?  I think this guy is dragging his feet. I don't feel 100% about this job but maybe I'm too fussy.

I'd be grateful for a quick reply.  I'm running out of time here.  I may have to give him a decision this evening about whether I'm going to sign his offered contract tomorrow morning or not.

The Public University is called China Youth University for Political Sciences located in Haidian district, in Beijing.

I just wonder, is it really any skin off his back to just put a line in there about the visa? Public universities usually won't employ people if they can't get them the right visa, because they can get in trouble over it, but what's the guy's deal with just stating it in writing?

Have you talked with any other FTs at the school? Can they maybe send you someone's number or e-mail address so that you can confirm that the school did issue visas for them, and at the same time, maybe talk to them about what working conditions at the school are like, etc. Since you're going to Hong Kong anyhow, there's no huge rush anymore, if the place doesn't check out, you can always take a different job.

Just pulled my contract.  I work at a public uni. No specific wording about z visa or FEC, etc.  What it says is, "Party A shall provide Party B necessary working and living conditions."  That's really broad, but I take it to include the necessary documents so that I can legally work for them.  Maybe I'm not picky enough.  But - they aren't going to do anything to get themselves in trouble, so I trust them to take care of those details on my behalf, without it being more specific in the contract.

Call me naive, but I'd take the guy's word that based on the fact that he represents a public university that his credibility - at least on applying for and securing documents - is sound.

Just pulled my contract.  I work at a public uni. No specific wording about z visa or FEC, etc.  What it says is, "Party A shall provide Party B necessary working and living conditions."

Is that the government contract or the specific contract/agreement between you and the uni?

That's really broad, but I take it to include the necessary documents so that I can legally work for them.  Maybe I'm not picky enough.  But - they aren't going to do anything to get themselves in trouble, so I trust them to take care of those details on my behalf, without it being more specific in the contract.

Call me naive, but I'd take the guy's word that based on the fact that he represents a public university that his credibility - at least on applying for and securing documents - is sound.

You're probably right.  I just feel though that this FAO guy have been a little condescending towards me.  As The Local Dialect said on the other thread, the question is "Do I really want this job?"    That is the question.  

http://raoulschinasaloon.com/index.php?topic=3819.msg74124#msg74124

Damn, I'm in a quandary.  Forces are pulling in opposite directions and I'm rent apart. [sighs]. I've no fecking idea what to do.  He sent me his last e-mail earlier today.  I still haven't replied.  I REALLY find annoying that first sentence in his last e-mail, "Ok.  You may go to another job interview.".

I met the guy.  He wrote that he talked to a police officer who confirmed that I could apply for a work visa in Hong Kong.  Yet, another guy, a representative of Beijing Jiaotong University, rang me yesterday and told me categorically that I cannot apply for a Z visa in Hong Kong.  My Chinese friend and I had sent, what do you call 'em, cold e-mails to as many uni e-mail addresses that we could find with all my info and this guy from Jiaotong university in Beijing got back within a day.

Even though I only talked to him for a minute, I trust him more than I trust the FAO guy from Beijing Youth University for Political Sciences.  It would appear that indeed I will have to go back to my home country of Ireland to reapply for a work visa to work in the municipality of Beijing in strict interpretation of the laws of the People's Republic of China and I'm not one for encouraging or participating in the breaking of or bending of laws in this country.  If I need to go back to my home country at this stage to start from scratch to reapply for a work visa to work in Beijing then so be it.  It makes sense actually that there is still a requirement in Beijing (like last year) to go back to one's home country to re-apply for a work visa if one has no time.  This October is the 60th anniversary of the foundation of the People's Republic of China.  If the tourist visa issuance situation in Beijing is anything to go by, (the circumstances under which issuing tourist visas in Beijing are very tight these days), then issuing work visas to work in Beijing in countries other than one's home country is going to be disallowed.

I mean the FAO guy from Beijing  Youth University for Political Sciences said some absolutely outrageous things to me already.  He told me that I could find part time work this summer in Beijing on a tourist visa I was planning to get in Hong Kong just by contacting the same recruiter who contacted me about his job offer.  I think he pulled that one out of his arse.  And, he also wrote to me that a police officer told him that I can apply for a z visa to work in Beijing to re-enter mainland China from Hong Kong.  I think this police officer he also opportunistically pulled out of his arse.  And if this police officer does exist, I reckon he's just as clueless as this FAO guy is.  I'll be fair to this FAO guy though, he's not the head of the FAO office.  There's little room for negotiation he can do without approval of the FAO director. The FAO Director is off for the weekend and apparently, according to the FAO guy, uncontactable.

I strongly advise ALWAYS getting the provision of a work permit and residence permit in writing. It can be in an amendment to the contract, which is basically just a typed piece of paper with the school's official chop on it...it's not like this is something difficult for them to do.

If a school refuses to honor this simple and basic request, I'd think at least twice about trusting them with anything else.

I'd also think twice about any FAO that suggests (illegally) working part-time on a tourist visa until they get their act together.