Chang Jiang Disease

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Re: Chang Jiang Disease
« Reply #60 on: May 31, 2009, 11:39:22 PM »
After so many months, I'm sure you found a solution by now.
I would try: "<name> is my name." (substituting their actual name for <name>)
The reason why is because they have physically recorded in their mouth muscle memory the phrase: "My na is...". My guess is that almost ANY variation on word order will require a new memory to be created and you can coach that correctly as it is being made.

Anyone have difficulty with the final 'm' sound?  I didn't encounter it up north, but it seems to be a universal problem here in Dongguan.  I can get everyone saying 'name, name, name' a million times.  Then we turn it to real life:  "What's your name?"  "My na is..."  llllllllll

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Mr Nobody

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Re: Chang Jiang Disease
« Reply #61 on: June 01, 2009, 12:27:13 AM »
Too true.
kinesthetic memory is very very specific. That's why most martial arts drills are useless, for example, if someone does something even a little different.
they are located in the hindbrain (thalamus from memory) and are just a few ganglions in size, smaller than the head of a pin. If it gets destroyed for some reason, then that skill can never be relearned. At least in rats.

Anyway:

To correct pronunciation I try to use words they cannot have heard of (archaic and obscure words for example), so they don't have a habit. They cannot learn that apple is not appoe. So, I use something else such as grapple make them practice it until they can, and then try to relate it back.

So far, I can get them to say L at the end of words, and other things supposedly difficult, but it is very hard to break the habit such as appoe or 'der' instead of 'the' etc. I then use peer pressure for that. This works reasonably well, but takes some time and needs careful attention to training the students to watch for errors in each other, using things like sound and visual cues, and get them to correct each other It is especially difficult to get them to enjoy correcting each other so there is an appreciable progression, which then spurs them to try harder.

But it works.


Just another roadkill on the information superhighway.

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Ruth

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Re: Chang Jiang Disease
« Reply #62 on: June 01, 2009, 02:02:36 PM »
Mrozark, that's brilliant.  Will try it soon.
If you want to walk on water, you have to get out of the boat.

Re: Chang Jiang Disease
« Reply #63 on: June 30, 2009, 05:21:15 AM »

Cognitive brain can get the ball rolling, but if you haven't done the homework of building the skill - the familiarity with making the sound - it won't come out right.

Michael Jordan did free throws hours a day. He didn't talk about it that much or study it or read books about it. He did it because he knows it was a matter of training and conditioning and building habits and patterns in muscles - not cognitive thought.

All interesting stuff.  I have to agree with Mrozark.  Let me relate to my personal experience as a actor.  When you rehearse lines your tongue starts to remember before your brain does.  Often leading you to the next phrase before congnition.  It is really physical memory, ala the Jordan reference.  A dancer does not think about each part of a back turn, their body remembers.  This happens over time.  The body has a physical memory.

Granted I live in the north, and it sounds like a real head banger.  Good Luck