Shit went downhill fast -_-

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2013, 06:37:04 PM »
Anyone happen to know how hard it is to get a repatriation loan? I'd rather go this route than borrowing money from family.

Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #31 on: June 05, 2013, 06:40:23 PM »
Wouldn't go that route. I am pretty sure the embassy will contact your friends and family first to make sure that you have no other way of getting money. Repatriation loan is a last resort when you are really really up shit creek.

They will also take away your passport, I believe, at least until the loan is paid back. Maybe longer? Someone might have experience with this but I'd really think long and hard about it before going to those measures. Repatriation loans are generally for people in much more dire straights than you currently are.

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #32 on: June 05, 2013, 07:20:49 PM »
Ok this school is seriously hellbent on extorting this money from me. I just got this email from them:

You won’t be able to avoid the penalty of breaking the contract even if us embassy is involved .If you don’t pay tomorrow , you must leave our apartment and return the key back to us. We will check later tomorrow night .If you are still there, we will call the police, then you will have trouble.

If you don’t pay the penalty, we will charge you to the court. We don’t intend to hold your passport, but will forward it to the court.

Normally it will take three to six months waiting for the final Judgment of the court. we have experienced many similar cases due to new teachers, arrogance and negative attitude. They all had a silly excuse or story like you. But non of them has avoided the penalty .Us embassy can not help. You have badly ruined our business, consequently deserve the penalty.


I am waiting for this officer from the Shenyang Consulate to call me. I am also on the verge of going to the police myself. Pleaseeeeee advise.

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #33 on: June 05, 2013, 07:22:33 PM »
This is the exact literature from the contract they're saying that entitles them to the 7000rmb.

If the employee fails to perform the terms set forth, the employer reserves the right to withhold up to 7000RMB, refuse all remaining bonuses, including airfare, and cancel the employee’s work permit.

Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #34 on: June 05, 2013, 08:03:07 PM »
I am going to be perfectly blunt here enjoi, and I don't think you want to hear this, but I think you owe them this penalty money.

You signed a contract. Your contract stipulates that if you break the contract, you pay a penalty. You want to break the contract, you should be held to the penalty.

A broken hot water heater and expecting you to show up for training sessions don't really count as a breach of contract on their part. Certainly not after less than 2 weeks in country. It doesn't really sound like a real effort was made on your part to try and work with them, you just decided you didn't like it and that you were gonna bail on the job.

And yes, it is your prerogative if you just don't like it and want to leave, but you signed a contract and you need to be prepared to abide by it. Nothing will piss people in China off more than a foreigner coming in acting like the rules don't apply to him and trying to throw the weight of the embassy around. Paying 7000rmb breach of contract penalty is not "extortion" it is paying the school back for the time and expense involved in bringing you over.

Again, I am not trying to be harsh here, but I hope that future China newbies read these threads and realize that there are consequences that happen when you break contracts. The school can't hold your passport, but if they want to take you to court and sue you for the breach of contract penalty, they can. The embassy may help you to a degree, but remember, they hear stories like this all the time, and they don't have to automatically come down on your side just because you're a US citizen. The job of the embassy isn't to make it easier for foreigners to breach their contracts in China with no repercussions.

Personally? I'd find a way to pay up, or tell them you don't have the money and try to negotiate a smaller penalty. Get into a hotel in the meantime. This might be difficult without your passport, so you're going to have to cooperate with the school somewhat and tell them you will vacate the premises but you need your passport in order to check into a hotel. Do you have a copy of it at least? By making this issue antagonistic, you've created a lot of hassle for yourself.

In the meantime, do as others have suggested and contact the entry/exit bureau of the PSB and ask what you should do. Explain things from your point of view and see if there is a way out. Wait to hear back from the consulate and see what they have to say, but do not hold your breath that they will be able to offer some sort of free pass or will be able to threaten the school into complying in any sort of meaningful way.

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #35 on: June 05, 2013, 08:08:36 PM »
That contract clearly implies they can hold up to 7000rmb of anything I've earned, including bonuses. It doesn't say they can hold my passport hostage if I don't pay an extortion fee, and that is exactly what it is.

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Monkey King

Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #36 on: June 05, 2013, 08:15:41 PM »
What a mess, agree with TLD mostly.  However,  unless there is more you aren't telling us, their response seems a bit unsettling and OTT.

E.g. Did the school pay your airfare or advance your pay or anything like that?  If they did, they are entitled to try and get that money back.


By the way:

Quote from: Some Language Mill
we have experienced many similar cases due to new teachers, arrogance and negative attitude. They all had a silly excuse or story like you.

You gotta love how the school sees no irony in writing this and no reflection on themselves.  "Yeah, we've lost hundreds of teachers here, we're getting pretty good at it..."

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A-Train

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #37 on: June 05, 2013, 08:32:30 PM »
That contract clearly implies they can hold up to 7000rmb of anything I've earned, including bonuses. It doesn't say they can hold my passport hostage if I don't pay an extortion fee, and that is exactly what it is.

Oi! I read the contract the same way.  But, I don't think this is extortion, it is about face. If you want this to end swiftly, you'll have to give them something; and I don't necessarily mean money. 
"The young do not know enough to be prudent, and therefore attempt the impossible and achieve it, generation after generation.

Pearl S. Buck

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #38 on: June 05, 2013, 08:33:10 PM »
What a mess, agree with TLD mostly.  However,  unless there is more you aren't telling us, their response seems a bit unsettling and OTT.

E.g. Did the school pay your airfare or advance your pay or anything like that?  If they did, they are entitled to try and get that money back.


By the way:

Quote from: Some Language Mill
we have experienced many similar cases due to new teachers, arrogance and negative attitude. They all had a silly excuse or story like you.

You gotta love how the school sees no irony in writing this and no reflection on themselves.  "Yeah, we've lost hundreds of teachers here, we're getting pretty good at it..."

No, I paid for my airfare. They took me to dinner, and have housed me, that's about it. I emailed her back and told her I don't want trouble, and that I don't have that kind of money but that i will pay what I can to compensate them. She is telling me my passport is Harbin and that the principal is in Jinzhou dealing with something extreme. I have no clue if that's the truth, I don't trust anyone at this point.

I talked to the consulate and he basically said all they're concerned with is getting my passport back and that everything is on me and the school. I have no clue how this shit is gonna pan out. They wanna kick me out tomorrow, yet they're telling me my passport isn't even here and I can't even check into a damn hotel without it. This is really making me hysterical.

Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #39 on: June 05, 2013, 08:40:50 PM »
That contract clearly implies they can hold up to 7000rmb of anything I've earned, including bonuses. It doesn't say they can hold my passport hostage if I don't pay an extortion fee, and that is exactly what it is.

You haven't earned anything yet though, so there is nothing for them to withhold, which, does not necessarily mean you owe nothing, it means that your salary is now -7000, according to the school. You'd have to see the Chinese translation of the contract to know for sure how this is supposed to be interpreted -- usually the Chinese version will trump the English in a dispute unless otherwise specified. A breach of contract penalty is pretty standard in any contract here in China though.

If it is at all possible, play nice with the school. If anything, you showed your hand too quickly by telling them you were going to leave before you had your passport back.

I think that face is playing into this here in a big way. You've gotten the embassy involved and have implied that this school is trying to do something illegal. From their point of view, they're the wronged party, because they hired a teacher, got him a legal visa, scheduled classes (and probably charged for those classes) and now they have nothing to show for it. They're pissed off. Right now it is up to you to de-escalate the situation and try to negotiate some sort of compromise. Thinking of things in terms of "extortion" is not really helpful. 

Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #40 on: June 05, 2013, 08:54:53 PM »
I am waiting for this officer from the Shenyang Consulate to call me. I am also on the verge of going to the police myself. Pleaseeeeee advise.

You should have gone to the police already.

Your employer hasn't done this before, they are bluffing.  This clause is rarely enforced because most people who want to run away are sensible enough to do it when they have their passport.  Honestly, could you not have waited a week?

Unless you are currently refusing to perform your duties then they are going to have a tough time justifying throwing you out of the apartment.  If you have been doing your duties then they can't budge you just because you want to leave as you will have yet break the contract - from what you have said though, I think you have stopped teaching so you have broken the contract and they can take action against you.  I don't think they are allowed to toss you out onto the street though, but they can certainly begin a process which will end there.

Either way you must go to the police yourself before they turn up your doorstep otherwise you will make this situation worse for yourself.

However, you are liable for the breach of the contract because, well, you are in breach of contract.  As I have said, there may be some perfectly sensible and legal restraints on people attempting to leave the country with unpaid debts but I am not sure of the extent of these.  

[edit]

I don't know if you are certainly past the point of no return with regards to de-escalating this situation but if not then you might want to try that.

From what you have posted of your correspondence though, it sounds like you are feeding off each others' hysteria a bit.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 09:01:42 PM by bobrage »

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Escaped Lunatic

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #41 on: June 05, 2013, 10:04:25 PM »
Email back.  Tell them "I've come to my senses and realize that I am throwing away a great opportunity to work for you.  I intend to stay and fulfill my contract."  Show up for any extra training and teach any scheduled classes, but skip showering since you have no hot water. uuuuuuuuuu  Be a model of cooperation otherwise - at least until you have your passport back (and maybe even have hot water by then).
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Guangzhou Writer

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #42 on: June 05, 2013, 10:40:28 PM »
Since they have threatened to put you out on the street without your passport, which is a major escalation that everyone should want to avoid, you must stay cool and go to the PSB immediately and ask them to get involved so you can stay until you get your passport and make arrangements to leave or get into a hotel.

I agree with bobrage that they are bluffing you about giving your passport to the court, blah, blah. That's nonsense, but if you don't find the right angle, they'll apparently be happy to do whatever they can to make you miserable.

Definitely avoid any sort of confrontation about getting out of the apartment. You've got to find some honey for that tongue before you get to that point 'cause otherwise things could get extra stupid, leading to a setup for some continuance of nonsense that would be in the criminal court and not the civil court.

You're dealing with people who are 101% predictable. Don't push their buttons. They know you don't have money, so what do they want that you're willing to give?

"Dear Blah,

I just had a long talk with my rabbi/mother/Boy Scout Leader/Jamaican psychic on the phone and he/she/it told me that he/she/it thinks I'm suffering acute culture shock, and also that no matter what happens I should be an honorable person.

I sincerely wanted things to work out right as an English teacher in China, so what can I do to make things right with the school? What if I were to X___ Y_______ or Z_______?

Thank you,
Honorable Laowai Steinberg"



Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #43 on: June 05, 2013, 11:27:48 PM »
Paging US Embassy for drone strike.

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enjoi

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Re: Shit went downhill fast -_-
« Reply #44 on: June 06, 2013, 12:07:23 AM »
Ya, going to that exit/entry PSB station was a complete waste of time and money. No one there spoke english. I called up the consulate while I was there and they said they wouldn't be able to do anything anyway. The consulate is calling me back in the morning and if I end up on the streets they're going to help me get a letter or something from the PSB to get into a hotel.

The school isn't being honest about where my passport is. Whether it's in Daqing or Harbin, who knows. I can either piss my family off even more and tell them I need this 7000rmb to pay these fools off, or I can call their bluff and see how long it takes them to hand over my passport to someone and how it all escalates. I'm afraid to let that happen because I don't for see anyone (PSB) pressuring them to get my passport handed over, and I don't have a lot of money to be living in a hotel.

Here's the latest email from the school:

Ask your family to wire you money immediately, otherwise      you will be strained here due to your irresponsible decision.  We can help you to check in a hotel with the copy of your passport.